Weewar Forum

**Lucian** · This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 29/12/2008 01:10:16

Force... this is exactly why we treat you as a little dipshit. Learn to differentiate between a useful thread and a spamatorium.

**General_Death**

lol, Force, are you trying to piss these guys off?..You lost me there.. What's with the Wee's man?..

And thanks boys, I was aware of most of these maps. You can still pull it off as red on most of them, but your skill has to be much higher than the other guy's, or else you're finished

**VTTruck** · This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 29/12/2008 03:38:48

GeneralDeath wrote:You can still pull it off as red on most of them, but your skill has to be much higher than the other guy's, or else you're finished

That's kind of a definition of a blue map, isn't it? Blue has an advantage and needs to screw up a few times for red
to have a chance (assuming red doesn't also screw the pooch).

**Lucian**

Updated to include maps by spencerglover.

**Muzzafar**

Not sure that this would be on topic, but I suppose I could mention Scary Pirate Island by alupa. It is not blue biased, it rather hates the red. The blue and purple are on about equal terms, but the red is in a serious disadvantage.

**Lucian** · This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 30/12/2008 13:15:07

Very true. Thanks for bringing that one up.

I've updated the list.

**Shulgin**

this one here:
The Unforgiven

blue can capture 3 bases and at the same time restrain red from getting the one in the north. on top of that the map maker gui kindly invites lots of people to play him on this map...preferable players whose score is not too high. for example here
http://weewar.com/game/133724
or here
http://weewar.com/game/133916

**Stagolee**

Shulgin wrote:this one here:
The Unforgiven

blue can capture 3 bases and at the same time restrain red from getting the one in the north. on top of that the map maker gui kindly invites lots of people to play him on this map...preferable players whose score is not too high. for example here
http://weewar.com/game/133724
or here
http://weewar.com/game/133916

Yup I was caught out by this too http://weewar.com/game/133289 four turns in you realize that he can reach the 3rd base and you can't

**VTTruck** · This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 18/01/2009 22:30:49

Make sure to use Mattie's map comments system to tag all these suckers. Lucian will soon post the
forum thread that had the instructions since I dont remember where it was.

Maybe given that this thread is more of a community service type of list, we could ask the devs to
link it directly from the games display, or at the bottom with the other links (like the tools).

**alupa**

Not sure that this would be on topic, but I suppose I could mention Scary Pirate Island by alupa. It is not blue biased, it rather hates the red. The blue and purple are on about equal terms, but the red is in a serious disadvantage.

Just thought I'd drop a line about this map. While at first glance red does seem to be disadvantaged, I would submit that there is a significant defensive advantage offered by his/her position. I would think that over the course of the game red actually had a stronger position if played correctly, as the water attack is cutoff with a limited land attack opportunity. I have been beaten by red several times and think that it's the player, not the board that makes the difference on this map.

Additionally, The island (mentioned above) has a slight blue bend, but red can overcome with smart play and active troops. I have been beaten nearly as many times as i've won on this map, and so I don't know that you can't overcome the odds...

...just thought i'd throw that out there.

**Lucian**

The Unforgiven map has been added and I'll add gui to the blacklist, though I'll talk to some of the people I trust that have preferred him and get their input before condemning him.

Mattie's map comment thread can be found here.

@ alupa: That's pretty much what we said. I put it on the bottom of the list and made a point that it is... "Blue and Purple biased. Red gets shafted." Basically I said that its unfair on red as you mentioned. The one place red gets shafted quickly is the distance of any harbors from blue. If blue mass produces destroyers/battleships and spams hovers and purple pushes a naval assault from the North (which generally happens), red has to fight on two fronts with an equal amount of income. Whilst certain spots allow a defensive barrier against hovercraft, it doesn't mean all that much against battleships and destroyers who can just pick off the coastal defenses and let the hovers rip at the ranged units, which won't be able to get away in time.

The Island much like with many of those has a slight advantage which can always be overcome, but there is just that ever so slight advantage that in a match of two equally skilled players the one that begins first will tend to win. I hope this doesn't deter you from making more maps as I truly do like most of the stuff you crank out and I think that the Scary Pirate Island is a work of art in it's own right, but with a few balancing issues such as moving the Southern red port closer to blue and giving red a few more bases could make the overall game a lot better. If red gets too powerful and captures the three middle bases it would get bombarded from two ends, so it would effectively negate any advantage it gained.

In regards to any of the maps I list up there, if anyone does have any objections, do speak up about them.

**alupa**

Good points, all, Lucian. Just wanted to sound off since the maps were under discussion.

Thanks for the nod,

Alupa

**Muzzafar**

alupa wrote:Just thought I'd drop a line about this map. While at first glance red does seem to be disadvantaged, I would submit that there is a significant defensive advantage offered by his/her position. I would think that over the course of the game red actually had a stronger position if played correctly, as the water attack is cutoff with a limited land attack opportunity. I have been beaten by red several times and think that it's the player, not the board that makes the difference on this map.
Additionally, The island (mentioned above) has a slight blue bend, but red can overcome with smart play and active troops. I have been beaten nearly as many times as i've won on this map, and so I don't know that you can't overcome the odds..

In my world a balanced map gives all players equal opportunities to win the game. If one of the players has to make extra effort or play in a certain way just to stay even - this is not what I would call "balanced".
In all games on this map that I played or witnessed the central bases were taken by either blue or purple, never red. In all games the red was on defensive, bound to fight on two fronts. So no, sir, this map is not balanced because this map hates the red.
As for getting your boop kicked by a red player on this map... Well, I managed to win a couple of Arubas playing as red. But that does not make Aruba a balanced map. If you know what I mean.

**bendamaster**

there's a slight blue advantage on this map

**troymadsen** · This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 04/02/2009 20:46:37

Wow...some people have a lot of time on there hands.

*actually I think I might have a chance on that map as red against DB....send me an invite

29/12/2008 01:09:58 Re:Biased Maps
Lucian Berserker Offline	Force... this is exactly why we treat you as a little dipshit. Learn to differentiate between a useful thread and a spamatorium. This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 29/12/2008 01:10:16
29/12/2008 03:32:00 Re:Biased Maps
General_Death Tank Offline	lol, Force, are you trying to piss these guys off?..You lost me there.. What's with the Wee's man?.. And thanks boys, I was aware of most of these maps. You can still pull it off as red on most of them, but your skill has to be much higher than the other guy's, or else you're finished
29/12/2008 03:38:44 Re:Biased Maps
VTTruck Berserker Offline	GeneralDeath wrote:You can still pull it off as red on most of them, but your skill has to be much higher than the other guy's, or else you're finished That's kind of a definition of a blue map, isn't it? Blue has an advantage and needs to screw up a few times for red to have a chance (assuming red doesn't also screw the pooch). This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 29/12/2008 03:38:48
29/12/2008 11:57:36 Re:Biased Maps
Lucian Berserker Offline	Updated to include maps by spencerglover.
30/12/2008 09:56:58 Re:Biased Maps
Muzzafar Raider Offline	Not sure that this would be on topic, but I suppose I could mention Scary Pirate Island by alupa. It is not blue biased, it rather hates the red. The blue and purple are on about equal terms, but the red is in a serious disadvantage.
30/12/2008 13:13:40 Re:Biased Maps
Lucian Berserker Offline	Very true. Thanks for bringing that one up. I've updated the list. This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 30/12/2008 13:15:07
18/01/2009 19:41:01 Re:Biased Maps
Shulgin Tank Offline	this one here: The Unforgiven blue can capture 3 bases and at the same time restrain red from getting the one in the north. on top of that the map maker gui kindly invites lots of people to play him on this map...preferable players whose score is not too high. for example here http://weewar.com/game/133724 or here http://weewar.com/game/133916
18/01/2009 20:55:47 Re:Biased Maps
Stagolee Heavy Trooper Offline	Shulgin wrote:this one here: The Unforgiven blue can capture 3 bases and at the same time restrain red from getting the one in the north. on top of that the map maker gui kindly invites lots of people to play him on this map...preferable players whose score is not too high. for example here http://weewar.com/game/133724 or here http://weewar.com/game/133916 Yup I was caught out by this too http://weewar.com/game/133289 four turns in you realize that he can reach the 3rd base and you can't
18/01/2009 22:29:33 Re:Biased Maps
VTTruck Berserker Offline	Make sure to use Mattie's map comments system to tag all these suckers. Lucian will soon post the forum thread that had the instructions since I dont remember where it was. Maybe given that this thread is more of a community service type of list, we could ask the devs to link it directly from the games display, or at the bottom with the other links (like the tools). This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 18/01/2009 22:30:49
19/01/2009 02:40:44 Re:Biased Maps
alupa Raider Offline	Not sure that this would be on topic, but I suppose I could mention Scary Pirate Island by alupa. It is not blue biased, it rather hates the red. The blue and purple are on about equal terms, but the red is in a serious disadvantage. Just thought I'd drop a line about this map. While at first glance red does seem to be disadvantaged, I would submit that there is a significant defensive advantage offered by his/her position. I would think that over the course of the game red actually had a stronger position if played correctly, as the water attack is cutoff with a limited land attack opportunity. I have been beaten by red several times and think that it's the player, not the board that makes the difference on this map. Additionally, The island (mentioned above) has a slight blue bend, but red can overcome with smart play and active troops. I have been beaten nearly as many times as i've won on this map, and so I don't know that you can't overcome the odds... ...just thought i'd throw that out there.
19/01/2009 10:52:24 Re:Biased Maps
Lucian Berserker Offline	The Unforgiven map has been added and I'll add gui to the blacklist, though I'll talk to some of the people I trust that have preferred him and get their input before condemning him. Mattie's map comment thread can be found here. @ alupa: That's pretty much what we said. I put it on the bottom of the list and made a point that it is... "Blue and Purple biased. Red gets shafted." Basically I said that its unfair on red as you mentioned. The one place red gets shafted quickly is the distance of any harbors from blue. If blue mass produces destroyers/battleships and spams hovers and purple pushes a naval assault from the North (which generally happens), red has to fight on two fronts with an equal amount of income. Whilst certain spots allow a defensive barrier against hovercraft, it doesn't mean all that much against battleships and destroyers who can just pick off the coastal defenses and let the hovers rip at the ranged units, which won't be able to get away in time. The Island much like with many of those has a slight advantage which can always be overcome, but there is just that ever so slight advantage that in a match of two equally skilled players the one that begins first will tend to win. I hope this doesn't deter you from making more maps as I truly do like most of the stuff you crank out and I think that the Scary Pirate Island is a work of art in it's own right, but with a few balancing issues such as moving the Southern red port closer to blue and giving red a few more bases could make the overall game a lot better. If red gets too powerful and captures the three middle bases it would get bombarded from two ends, so it would effectively negate any advantage it gained. In regards to any of the maps I list up there, if anyone does have any objections, do speak up about them.
19/01/2009 17:43:06 Re:Biased Maps
alupa Raider Offline	Good points, all, Lucian. Just wanted to sound off since the maps were under discussion. Thanks for the nod, Alupa
20/01/2009 22:29:41 Re:Biased Maps
Muzzafar Raider Offline	alupa wrote:Just thought I'd drop a line about this map. While at first glance red does seem to be disadvantaged, I would submit that there is a significant defensive advantage offered by his/her position. I would think that over the course of the game red actually had a stronger position if played correctly, as the water attack is cutoff with a limited land attack opportunity. I have been beaten by red several times and think that it's the player, not the board that makes the difference on this map. Additionally, The island (mentioned above) has a slight blue bend, but red can overcome with smart play and active troops. I have been beaten nearly as many times as i've won on this map, and so I don't know that you can't overcome the odds.. In my world a balanced map gives all players equal opportunities to win the game. If one of the players has to make extra effort or play in a certain way just to stay even - this is not what I would call "balanced". In all games on this map that I played or witnessed the central bases were taken by either blue or purple, never red. In all games the red was on defensive, bound to fight on two fronts. So no, sir, this map is not balanced because this map hates the red. As for getting your boop kicked by a red player on this map... Well, I managed to win a couple of Arubas playing as red. But that does not make Aruba a balanced map. If you know what I mean.
04/02/2009 20:17:55 Re:Biased Maps
bendamaster Heavy Trooper Offline	there's a slight blue advantage on this map
04/02/2009 20:46:29 Re:Biased Maps
troymadsen Tank Offline	Wow...some people have a lot of time on there hands. actually I think I might have a chance on that map as red against DB....send me an invite This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 04/02/2009 20:46:37*